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Joe the Plumber needs to shut the fuck up


I heard on NPR this morning that an independent group has found that 80% of Americans would benefit from Obama's financial plans, whereas only the richest 20% would benefit from McCain's.

Reminds me of this:

Comments

( 45 comments — Comment )
robearal
Oct. 23rd, 2008 06:22 pm (UTC)
Surprise!

Not.
darrelx
Oct. 23rd, 2008 06:24 pm (UTC)
Of course they'd benefit... That's socialism at work, stealing money from hard workers and giving it to underacheivers.

No thank you.
justplainbryan
Oct. 23rd, 2008 06:36 pm (UTC)
Gah! Why you gotta be hatin' on underachievers like me? Let me mooch from you in peace! I have to eat and go to the movies too, you know!



:D
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 24th, 2008 02:31 am (UTC) - Expand
esprix
Oct. 23rd, 2008 06:38 pm (UTC)
Because it's better for the rich to get richer and the poor to get poorer?

No, thank you.
[no subject] - darrelx - Oct. 23rd, 2008 07:26 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 23rd, 2008 08:03 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - darrelx - Oct. 23rd, 2008 09:55 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 24th, 2008 02:24 am (UTC) - Expand
fatefox
Oct. 23rd, 2008 07:16 pm (UTC)
I thought socialism was when the government bought up banks to keep the economy from collapsing....
[no subject] - darrelx - Oct. 23rd, 2008 07:40 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - ben_raccoon - Oct. 24th, 2008 01:13 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 24th, 2008 02:24 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - ben_raccoon - Oct. 24th, 2008 03:55 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 24th, 2008 04:54 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - ben_raccoon - Oct. 24th, 2008 03:55 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 24th, 2008 07:08 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - ben_raccoon - Oct. 25th, 2008 02:17 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 25th, 2008 02:32 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - ben_raccoon - Oct. 25th, 2008 04:05 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 25th, 2008 06:40 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - ben_raccoon - Oct. 24th, 2008 01:19 am (UTC) - Expand
(Deleted comment)
esprix
Oct. 23rd, 2008 07:21 pm (UTC)
No doubt those golden parachutes will come falling from the sky into all of our backyards any day now!
(Deleted comment)
[no subject] - darrelx - Oct. 23rd, 2008 07:29 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 23rd, 2008 08:10 pm (UTC) - Expand
weirddave
Oct. 23rd, 2008 07:45 pm (UTC)
Nothing personal Esprix, you know I like you, but maybe it's you who should shut up and listen
(This is not said in a mean may. Just FYI)


Cute cartoon, but it's wrong. The so-called "Clinton surplus" was a projected surplus if the tech boom we were in had continued indefinitely. Obviously, this didn't happen and it's foolish to pretend like it had any realistic chance of happening. Look at the real numbers for the total debt: Debt when Clinton elected-$4 trillion. When he left office-$5.6 trillion. They all lie, every single one of them, and every single one of them spends more than we as a nation have, and it's going to kill us sooner or later. I'd rather it be later.


The study you quoted isn't exactly wrong, but it's misleading as all hell. Under Obama's plan, almost half the nation-44%-would pay no taxes at all. That's all well and good, and I suppose that you could argue that those people are so poor that they shouldn't have to pay taxes (I wouldn't entirely agree, but I don't have a big problem with the argument either, it mostly comes down to where you want to draw the line, 44%? 20%? 70%?), and if that was as far as it went, fine. However, Obama also wants to provide a half dozen new refundable tax credits which would mean that the government is now sending these people a check even though they didn't pay a dime in taxes. Not cutting their taxes, paying them actual money that they did nothing to earn. That's flat out wealth redistribution. It's welfare, no other name for it. Obama knows that putting 44% of the country on direct welfare payments wouldn't fly, so he's doing it this backhanded way.

It's obvious that Obama's plan then "benefits" those 44%. Of course it does, they're getting free money! Add in the next 35% who won't see an increase in taxes, and suddenly 80% of the country "benefits" from Obama's financial plans. I'm sorry though, when half of America is on the dole, I don't think that benefits anyone at all. Funding basic services for the truly poor is the duty of a just society. This is not that, this is so far beyond that that it's laughable. This is...buying votes by promising anything to get elected and vowing that someone else-probably those rich bastards over there, you don't like them anyway, who do they think they are with their money and jobs and homes and cars and crap they earned?-will pay for it.
esprix
Oct. 23rd, 2008 08:12 pm (UTC)
I'd rather tax those that can afford it more than drain those who can't to death. I'm not happy about paying more taxes, either, but I see a benefit to helping those who need it rather than protecting those that don't.
weirddave
Oct. 23rd, 2008 08:28 pm (UTC)
I see a benefit to helping those that need it too, but answer me this: Do you think 44% of the people in America need a handout to survive*? Honestly? Almost 1 out of 2 people needs/deserves a handout from the Feds? And you and I should pay for it with our taxes? That's good use of our tax money?




*10-15%, maybe upwards of 20%? Sure, no problem: food stamps, Section 8 housing, Medicaid, etc...-I'm all for that, in fact I wouldn't want to live in a country that didn't provide that.....But just handing cash to people making lower middle to middle class incomes? Where does/should it end?
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 23rd, 2008 08:39 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 23rd, 2008 09:16 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 23rd, 2008 09:19 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 23rd, 2008 09:26 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 24th, 2008 02:26 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - weirddave - Oct. 25th, 2008 02:34 am (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - darrelx - Oct. 23rd, 2008 10:05 pm (UTC) - Expand
[no subject] - esprix - Oct. 24th, 2008 02:26 am (UTC) - Expand
jsciv
Oct. 23rd, 2008 08:50 pm (UTC)
Re: Nothing personal Esprix, you know I like you, but maybe it's you who should shut up and listen
Hey, do you have a reference for Obama's plan? I have heard a couple of people make this claim and I just wanted to go read what it says for myself.

Thanks!
weirddave
Oct. 23rd, 2008 09:18 pm (UTC)
Re: Nothing personal Esprix, you know I like you, but maybe it's you who should shut up and listen
It's on his website: www.barackobama.com. Here's a WSJ article analyzing the plan, saying many of the things I'm saying to Esprix.
felis_ultharus
Oct. 23rd, 2008 10:04 pm (UTC)
Yep -- no matter what country, that's the way it is. I think I've said it before, here.

Now our conservative economist-by-trade Prime Minister is projecting that our multi-billion-dollar surplus might turn into a deficit this year. Thing is, everyone seems surprised.
esprix
Oct. 24th, 2008 02:27 am (UTC)
Shocking! Er, no, wait...
( 45 comments — Comment )

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