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More Palin info


Posted as much for my own benefit as to challenge those who are masturbating wildly to Sarah Palin, I present "About Sarah Palin", an e-mail written by Alaskan Anne Kilkenny about her personal experiences knowing and living in the same town as Palin. I heard an interview with Kilkenny on NPR on the ride home, so I looked it up when I got home and was very interested to read more about Palin. Not all good stuff, but fairly accurate information from one woman's point of view.

Now of course I'm not voting Republican, but the more I hear about Palin the less I like, not only because I'm strongly opposed to her politics, but because McCain is older than dirt and she's just about the last person I'd want to be president. Granted there are a lot of racist nutjobs out there so I'm sure Obama's Secret Service personnel are going to be kept rather busy, but should the worse come to pass, I have few problems with Biden taking over.

Comments

( 23 comments — Comment )
weirddave
Sep. 6th, 2008 03:48 pm (UTC)
So let me ask you something Alan: How much weight should I give to a letter written about you, who you really are and what you are really like, by that guy you kicked off of your campsite at your whatever it is you go to? How much credibility do you give to the Swiftboat Veterans for Truth WRT John Kerry? They DID serve with the man, although I would tend to think you might not agree with their statements. Why is it that he said/she said bullshit (which is all this is-and not even accurate bullshit, Palin never fired the librarian, she did fire and then rehire the dept manager who oversaw the library, but she fired every dept head to put in her own people when she was elected, which is common and correct) is VITALLY IMPORTANT, MUST READ INFO, HERE ARE THE TRUE FACTS when it trashes someone that one doesn't like and "swiftboating garbage" if it trashes someone that a given person supports.

As for the last part, I agree. If someone is going to ascend to the presidency from the VP position, it's not even close who the best person for the job would be. I'd take Palin over Biden in that situation in a New York minute.
buddykat
Sep. 6th, 2008 06:49 pm (UTC)
Palin never fired the librarian, she did fire and then rehire the dept manager who oversaw the library, but she fired every dept head to put in her own people when she was elected, which is common and correct

The letter clearly states that she *tried* to fire the librarian, not that she did fire her.

And I don't know where you live, but in my little corner of the world (Poway, CA / San Diego County), it is not "common and correct" to fire all of the city department heads to put your own people in when you are elected Mayor. AFAIK, none of those types of positions are political appointee positions in my area, they are filled by the normal process of advertising the position and then hiring the person who is most qualified.

While the letter from Anne Kilkenny may contain a lot of things that are not flattering to Palin, it also does not try to slam her. It *does* point out a lot of things that many people consider positive traits in anyone, not just Palin.

As Kilkenny very clearly states, the letter is an opinion piece. One person's opinion, and she felt it important to send it to *40* people - her friends and family. Someone else felt it important enough to post in multiple places on the internet. Just about everything in the letter that is not opinion can be verified with research; either through the state of Alaska, or through the city of Wasilla.
esprix
Sep. 6th, 2008 07:35 pm (UTC)
I was rather impressed with the positive things she had to say about Palin, and they are admirable. The negative, IMHO, is what outweighs it all.
esprix
Sep. 6th, 2008 07:34 pm (UTC)
Oh, don't think I haven't read what the Republicans have to say about her, either. I'll grant you that a fair portion of what's written in the letter does seem like de rigeur for a new mayor or governor, but there's enough from multiple sources for me to really not like her (in addition to her political leanings). Plus a lot of the factual information (things like budget figures), although they can obviously be spun different ways, are kind of factual. Of course, as you say, no one has to agree that this is any kind of truth, but like the Swift Boat boys, in politics you choose who to believe - I didn't believe them, but I'm inclined to believe Anne Kilkenny.

Hooray for differing political views! :) Now if only we'd break out of this stupid 2-party system...
doc_cathode
Sep. 6th, 2008 09:33 pm (UTC)
In all seriousness, it must be hard for you being surrounded by all these liberals.
weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 02:21 am (UTC)
It has it's moments, but not really. Esprix is a friend, I like and respect HIM (see Alan, you should get me to write that bio about you ;)), even if I disagree with some of his politics. It's the lunatics on the SDMB that really bother me, they make it personal, and Stormtrooper Shayna leads that list. *shudder* She's the one that actually scares me, because I could honestly see her cheerfully shoving Jews into furnaces in another time and place.

Back on topic, I am a conservative Democrat, a breed that many would deny can still exist, one that hasn't seen it's heyday since JFK. I suspect quite strongly that Esprix and I would agree on most social issues, although I bet we'd disagree on method of achieving them. I am supporting McCain not because I am super behind him or Palin (although she has impressed me mightily), but because Obama's plan, no matter how he tries to hide it, is good old fashioned tax and spend, spend, spend, and I think that would be a disaster for the US after 8 years of Bush's fiscal insanity. IMO, an Obama presidency with a Democratic majority in Congress puts us deep in a recession/depression, besides that I am fiscally very conservative and I vehemently disagree with that philosophy of government as, and I'm not exaggerating here, evil.
doc_cathode
Sep. 7th, 2008 02:29 am (UTC)
So you're a boll weevil?
weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 06:27 am (UTC)
I'm going to remember that I have met you and like you and assume that you can not possibly realize what you are implying here, so I'm not going to even dignify that with a response beyond this*.



*Oh, ok, I will, but "Boll Weevil" is an offensive (to me) term. Boll Weevils opposed desegregation and civil rights. Nothing could be further from my beliefs. I generally reject labels, but "Blue Dog Democrat" will suffice if you feel the need to paste one on me.
doc_cathode
Sep. 7th, 2008 06:33 am (UTC)
No insult intended. I thought boll weevil just meant ' A southern Democrat who acts like a Republican'.

What the hell is a Blue Dog Democrat? You base your position on the show Blue's Clues?
weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:20 am (UTC)
Wiki is your friend

Edited at 2008-09-07 08:22 am (UTC)
esprix
Sep. 7th, 2008 03:43 am (UTC)
So you, like me, are in love with Ed Rendell? :D

I think the difference between us is the social issues, if I may be blunt. Although we agree on them (and I know we do), they are *far* more important to me than anything else, because they directly impact my very existence. A Republican, toting the Republican party platform (no matter now much of a "renegade" he might tout himself to be), is simply not an option for me, period. Is Obama's budget plan the best? Nope. Nor, IMHO, is McCain's - it's got to be somewhere in the middle. But given that neither of their fiscal plans impress me one way or the other, my leanings go strongly towards their social platforms, and in that the Democrats win hands down.

I will say that it kind of shocks me that you'd vote for McCain, but now at least I understand more why, and I can respect that. :)
weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:08 am (UTC)
'Spree, I hope you won't take this the wrong way, but I would hesitate to admit that my "love" for any man was "like yours". :P

That being said, I agree with you completely about social issues . That's what I was referring to when I said "I bet we'd disagree on the best method of achieving them." I was thinking specifically about an issue that I'm sure doesn't concern you in the least, gay marriage. You and I both think that gay folks should be allowed to marry (Why should that misery be confined to us breeders? :P) I can believe that, I can argue for it, I can go out and march in the streets for it, hell, I can get in a riot supporting gay marriage and crawl my beaten and bruised body home afterwards. So can you. The difference is that when I get home, my wife will tend my wounds, my kids will comfort me me, if I'm hospitalized my wife will consult on my care, if I die my kids will inherit the fruits of my life's labor, and nobody will think that that's wrong or even unusual. Legally, you've got a roommate. WTF? ( I just realized that this paragraph is about the least necessary thing I've ever written, we both know of and agree about the problem. Indulge me, I've had a few beers tonight, and sometimes I like to pontificate when I'm buzzed(BTW, I'm listening to Broadway show tunes, are we really sure that you're the gay one here? :p))

To get back on track, here's my fear WRT gay marriage. I fear that it will be accomplished the wrong way, and the whole "right way"/"wrong way" discussion gets to the heart of my political beliefs. Gay marriage is an issue that will be resolved, and I think it will be resolved through the fullness of time in our favor. It's coming, and it's coming now, in our lifetimes. Several states have recognized it, and as time goes on, more and more will until it's universal. Hell, even Sarah Palin vetoed a law that would deny spousal benefits to gay partners because she had been advised that it was unconstitutional in Alaska. She acted against her own personal beliefs because that's the law in that state, and that's one of the big reasons I really like her. She's a Republican and personally against gay rights, but she still did the right thing 'cuz that was the LAW. That impressed me. We're going to get full marriage rights for gay folks as well as straight ones, it's inevitable.

Of course that does nothing for you personally, sitting on the outside looking in, saying " Yea, sure, thanks guys for finally beginning to recognize me and my spouse, but we want our rights NOW". If I was you I would feel the exact same way, AND I WOULD WANT MY LOVE TO BE RECOGNIZED RIGHT NOW!!

As much as I agree, it won't be. I'm sorry more than you know Alan( but not as sorry as you are hurt that it's not ). I can't change that. All I can do is look to the future and think about just exactly HOW you equal rights will come about.

There are only 2 ways it can happen as far as I can see: By judicial fiat or by legislative action. I see the later process as the one that is going on right now.


But that doesn't do a damn thing for you. That takes time, and you love your partner right now. I'm making a guess here, but I would guess that you want those rights by judicial decision. If *I* was you I would. The SCOUS swoops in and ends the matter. Immediately satisfying, and it gives you what you deserve.

Personally, not being real life involved in the question, I don't agree. I'm sorry, I don't. It KILLS me to say that, but it's true. I think that judicial fiat supporting gay marriage would be the worst think that could happen.


Let me explain. I tend to look at things from a historical point of view. I am a historian by education after all. I see the gay marriage issue in the same light as I see two other issues that were settled when I was a wee lad: Civil rights and abortion.




weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:08 am (UTC)
LJ made me cut this
Civil rights: In the '60s, the civil rights movement made great strides and finally made our culture accept the ideals that we had just paid lip service to: "All men are created equal". This was done by legislation and activision, MAKING the establishment abide by the rules that they had convieniently ignored. The SCOUS supported this position, interpeting the laws and while we're not perfect today, and racism still exists, I think any rational person can agree that institutionalized racism is a thing of the past.

Contrast that with abortion. Abortion was legalized by judicail fiat. The SCOUS abruptly decided that abortion was legal. Prior to their decision, abortion rights had been working their slow way through the various state legislatures. Many had approved them, some had not. Roe rendered all that moot. Abortion was legal, period.

So, 40 years later, lets look at where we stand WRT both issues. Civil rights are an accepted fact, There are some neanderthals who deny that, but racial acceptance is the default position. Abortion is still hotly contested as an issue. I want gay rights to follow the first path. It's the way our country was set up, it's the way things should be. I suspect that you would want gay rights to follow the second path. I would if I was you, it's your life, you want to live it NOW. I just don't think that that is the best long term.


Forgive me for wanting long term stability over expediency. *I* don't have to live this, you do.

The whole thing kinda sucks, but I hope I have expressed my opinion clearly. Long term, I think I'm right. Long term. I have the luxury of thinking that way, I'm not involved. You are.

And I'm sorrier for that than most things in my life. It's NOT FAIR. But shortcutting to ensure a "fair" outcome is the fastest way to hell on earth that I know.
esprix
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:12 am (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
Heavens, you do pontificate when you're drunk. :P

Actually, I agree with just about everything you said, so it's not really about how soon it happens; with the Republicans, it won't happen at all, whereas with the Democrats, something will happen. (This also goes to the larger social issues I hold dear, abortion rights being one of them.)

You can also see this icon for the rest of my checklist. :P
weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:18 am (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
Jesus Christ you're fast! I wrote out my manifesto, and posted it, and thought " I'll just check my e-mail before I retire" and here you had a whole response!

Fuck it, how about you and yours come up here to B-more sometime soon to hang with me and mine so I can grill steaks and we can shoot the shit? I know Gingy would like to see you, I would too.
esprix
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:20 am (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
She'll give me yucky girly ookies, but yes, we'd love to see you before we move back to SoCal. Perhaps one weekend we'll swing by on our way up to or back from Mom's in Philly. If you're up for it, we're also planning on doing the Ren Faire in Annapolis I think Sept. 27 with a bunch of my crazy SCA friends.
weirddave
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:38 am (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
Ren fair is in Anne Arundel county. You wanna come by before or after? ( If I was you I'd chose after, we're between AA and Philly, and when I'm cooking for friends, I go all out. ) I can't do anything about girl ookies, but I suspect you'll survive. I've gotten over the gay phobia when you touch me, try and man up for the fags.


Seriously, can we call this a date? I would love to throw some steaks on the grill for you guys on the 27th and crack a beer with y'all. We'll have to take our political discussions outside if we have them, my wife is from a country where they have elections on a whim, regular politicing on a timetable confuses her. That doesn't matter. She tends to take after people discussing rational politics(HA!) with a cast iron skillet.
esprix
Sep. 7th, 2008 10:12 pm (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
I don't know that we'd be able to do it on the 27th, as we're meeting a large group of people to do the Faire. We'll have to make plans otherwise. :)
weirddave
Sep. 8th, 2008 04:56 am (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
Fair 'nuff. Well, one weekend before it gets cold anyway.
esprix
Sep. 7th, 2008 08:17 am (UTC)
Re: LJ made me cut this
I'll also add I saw more info on Palin tonight about her church offering "pray away the gay" seminars. Yeah. Again, this does not make me think she's on my side in any way, shape or form, especially given this part of the same article:

She is staunchly anti-abortion, opposing exceptions for rape and incest, and opposes gay marriage and spousal rights for gay couples...

Gay activists in Alaska said Palin has not worked actively against their interests, but early in her administration she supported a bill to overrule a court decision to block state benefits for gay partners of public employees. At the time, less than one-half of 1 percent of state employees had applied for the benefits, which were ordered by a 2005 ruling by the Alaska Supreme Court.

Palin reversed her position and vetoed the bill after the state attorney general said it was unconstitutional. But her reluctant support didn't win fans among Alaska's gay population...
Again, it's just The Republican Way, and I can't support that. If worse ever came to worst and I just absolutely could not get behind a Democrat ticket, I'd gladly vote 3rd party or Independent before voting right wing.
(Deleted comment)
esprix
Sep. 6th, 2008 07:34 pm (UTC)
I have a hard time thinking of McCain dealing with those people!
buddykat
Sep. 6th, 2008 09:13 pm (UTC)
Thought you'd be interested...
Another friend just posted this article about Palin by an Alaskan native woman now living in Ireland.
esprix
Sep. 6th, 2008 11:13 pm (UTC)
Re: Thought you'd be interested...
Thanks for the link.
( 23 comments — Comment )

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